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ghost_valley2021-10-22 01:01 pm
shadaras) wrote in ghost_valley2021-10-22 01:01 pm
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[WoH Rewatch] Episode 20
List of Scenes
Long Que tells them about the library and accepts Chengling as his disciple
Long Que asks for his chains to be removed
ZZS names WKX as Zhen Yan
Long Que dies
Gu Xiang and Cao Weining discuss going to Qing Feng Sword Sect
Liu Qianqiao and Yu Qiufeng discuss if they can use Luo Fumeng as leverage against Zhao Jing
Zhao Jing leads a meeting of the Five Lakes Alliance, receives accolades, and tells people to search for Xiaoliang and Chengling
Liu Qianqiao talks to Gu Xiang about their respective men and plans
Xie-wang meets with Zhao Jing. He’s told he’s a good boy and given new orders.
Long Xiao chooses to die via drug men rather than tell Zhou Zishu and Wen Kexing any secrets
Everyone at Long Que’s grave
ZZS, WKX, and Chengling talk about where to go next (Siji Manor)
ZZS pokes at WKX about the shidi thing some more
Flashback to Zhen Yan and ZZS meeting, and Zhen Yan being accepted as QHZ’s disciple
Zhou Zishu’s very happy about having his shidi back, but Wen Kexing snaps and runs away
Timeline or Something
Zhao Jing makes reference, in this episode, to having been chief for “a few months” (since the Heroes Conference at Mount Jun, which is a place name I honestly don’t recall getting until this episode).
This episode otherwise appears to take place over probably a day? Plus the flashback to twenty years ago, of course.
Recap
Long Que laughs (coughing a bit), which gets everyone’s attention. He talks a bit about how parents want the best for their children, and things they don’t offer are things they can’t. (There’s a shot, as Long Xiao looks over, clearly listening.) He then tells ZZS where Longyuan Pavillion’s library is, which contains maps of the valley and its traps, and asks ZZS to give the latter to YBY.
Long Que also says he’s written all of Longyuan Pavillion’s techniques into two books stored in the library, and he wants ZZS to find him a successor. ZZS tells Long Que he’s taken Chengling as his disciple (and that he didn’t previously know that QHZ and ZYS had been friends!), and offers that Chengling could take up Longyuan Pavillion’s techniques as well. Long Que thinks this is a great idea; Chengling mastering three styles will be a testament to the friendship of Long Que’s generation.
After Chengling has acknowledged Long Que as another shifu, Long Que asks ZZS to use his Baiyi sword to cut the chains binding Long Que. WKX is all “But that’ll kill you!”, but framed to describe what’ll happen to Long Que if the chains are removed in basically identical ways to what’ll happen to ZZS if the nails are removed.
Long Que doesn’t care; he doesn’t think there’s any meaning to live longer: “My friends have died, so has my love and my disciples. I owe the world nothing.” (This is too pointed to be anything other than an intentional parallel to ZZS after WKX fakes his death.)
Chengling begs Long Que not to die, and Long Que says death isn’t something to be afraid of, but a kind of release. Survival is a kind of torture for him, he says, and then asks again for ZZS to cut off the chains; he doesn’t want to carry them into the afterlife. ZZS draws Baiyi, then hands it to WKX.
WKX takes Baiyi (also: cannot get over that between these two shots, which are a few frames apart, they change the placement of ZZS and WKX’s hands) and slices off the chains. Then he drops Baiyi.
Chengling promises Long Que that he’ll do well as a disciple, and continues begging Long Que not to die.
ZZS makes up his mind, and says “Zhen Yan, do you really not intend to tell Long-bobo your true identity?” as the ending theme starts playing. He takes WKX by the shoulders (because WKX is stunned and crying) and hugs him. They’re very cute.
ZZS touches WKX’s hair and calls him “shidi”, at which point WKX pushes him away and (quite nervously) is like “Who are you calling? What’s wrong with you?” ZZS takes his hand and addresses Long Que instead, saying that the Zhen couple concealed their identities and spent their remaining years in comfort, while their kid (looks at WKX) grew up into a good but annoying man. Long Que asks if QHZ helped them, and ZZS says he did; he disguised the parents and took the child as his disciple.
Long Que is very satisfied by this. He then dies, and everyone is surprised and upset. The three of them bow to him, and then ZZS takes Chengling out of the cave. WKX stays behind, alone, and thanks Long Que while crying.
Back in Yueyang, Gu Xiang thinks about where WKX is and wonders why he hasn’t sent her any kind of message. She finds CWN sitting at a table, and scolds him for being out of bed. He says he needs to recover and return to Qing Feng Sword Sect. GX is grouchy about this. CWN says he likes her fierceness, but GX cuts him off—before he can say that she actually has a soft heart—to proclaim he doesn’t know her at all.
CWN lets that all slide, and asks GX if she’d be willing to come back to Qing Feng Sword Sect with him. She’s like “Why should I? I gotta find my master!”, and CWN says that he’s (still) going to Qing Feng Sword Sect first. After GX looks a little sad and glances away, CWN takes her hand and promises that, so long as he’s alive, he’ll always come back to her. She says she might not remember him, then relents and asks what’s happening with Qing Feng Sword Sect.
CWN talks about how weird it is that his master, who is such good friends with Gao Chong, left and didn’t attend the conference. GX quickly realises it’s likely that [his master] left with the Glazed Armor, and CWN confirms that’s his suspicion/fear as well. He points out that if they can figure it out, others can too, and says he needs to go and check it out.
GX says she’ll go with him, saying she’ll protect him (“a wounded fool”), and he’s delighted. Then she tells him to drink his medicine. As he does, she thinks to herself that she’s doing this to learn where the Glazed Armor is and that it’s definitely not about her following CWN for CWN’s own sake.
Meanwhile, LQQ is attempting to feed LFM soup. LFM is very out of it. After a moment, LQQ stands up and leaves LFM to it, instead going over to where YQF is standing. He starts talking to her, clearly continuing a prior conversation about if they should use LFM as a tool to ruin Zhao Jing’s reputation. He wants to, but LQQ doesn’t; she knows that Zhao Jing’s reputation won’t be ruined just by saying he was fickle in love when he was young.
YQF persists, saying that LFM becoming Xisang Gui as a result of Zhao Jing’s actions would change things. LQQ doesn’t think they’d gain anything from this. YQF thinks they could get information about the Glazed Armor from Zhao Jing. (That CWN and GX think they know where the Glazed Armor is, but YQF and LQQ don’t, is a fascinating contrast between these two conversations.)
YQF wants the Glazed Armor so that he can access the Armory and get the Yin Yang Book for LQQ, which he thinks can heal her scars and thus fix the wrongs he did to her long ago. He’s trying to display how much he cares for her. I’m not sure it’s working as well as he thinks. But before LQQ can really respond, GX interrupts by calling for LQQ, and the scene ends.
At Yueyang Sect, Zhao Jing and the Five Lakes World Alliance meet in the hall. (I learn that the guy with the shaved sides of his head is “Leader Sha” [沙帮主].) They’re talking about gaining more allies. Zhao Jing protests that him being chief (which he’s been for “a few months”) is definitely a temporary arrangement. Apparently the Alliance’s reputation is increasing and improving, though!
Zhao Jing reminds everyone that they should be looking for Gao Xiaolian and Zhang Chengling. He calls Xiaolian “a vulnerable lady who has never set foot into the jianghu” and who shouldn’t be caught up in all this nonsense. Chengling, he says, simply disappeared with “a mystery man” and that’s concerning. Everyone agrees to help look for them. Leader Sha sticks his foot in his mouth by saying they’ll bring them back “alive or dead”, and the scene ends with him apologising for that.
LQQ talks to GX, who wants to know what YQF did to get LQQ to work with him. GX says she’s heard about “this two-timer” from her sisters in the Department of the Unfaithful, and doesn’t understand why LQQ would still spend time with him. LQQ says that things are turbulent, LFM isn’t in her right mind and that neither of them (LQQ and GX) are good at martial arts (which: by whose standard? They’re pretty good; they just hang around very talented people.) so they can’t get LFM out of here and need YQF’s protection. GX thinks this is nonsense, and they could use LQQ’s disguise skills to get out and then ask the other ghosts to tear YQF to shreds.
LQQ tells her that the Top 10 Ghosts scheme and intrigue against each other and “girls like [them]” depend on stronger martial artists (LFM for LQQ; WKX for GX) to protect them. GX thinks it doesn’t matter, since WKX would kill anyone who dared bully them. LQQ reminds her that WKX isn’t here right now, so he can’t help. LQQ says she’s sent girls out searching for WKX, so he’ll contact them when he finds them.
GX is scornful of the idea that LQQ and LFM are going to stay here with YQF until WKX returns. LQQ says she can handle YQF. GX keeps going off about him, and we learn that LQQ didn’t drink Meng Po Soup when she entered the valley (and thus didn’t forget YQF) but now GX thinks she should’ve (because YQF being entangled with them is trouble).
LQQ scolds her for being young and not knowing enough. GX drops the subject, and asks if she knows how to help LFM. We learn that re-awakening memories that the Meng Po Soup took from you has a strong negative effect, and that LFM is suffering from that right now. LQQ also says that LFM suffered from “soul-dissociation” before, and that “her mind is more chaotic than others”, which are the explanations for how/why LFM seems detached from the world.
LQQ finally asks GX why she came here, and GX says she said she’s here to say goodbye before leaving for Qing Feng Sword Sect with CWN. LQQ smiles as GX protests that she’s not doing this for CWN. LQQ says she’s suddenly being sensible. GX says she doesn’t want to leave when LQQ’s in such a situation. LQQ tells her that it’s alright, and she should go; LQQ says GX will grow up and learn how precious people are, and how much even one day with the right person can matter. (The surface-level read would be that she’s talking about YQF; paying attention to her actual feelings makes it much more likely the loved one LQQ’s thinking about is LFM.)
We cut from there to Xie-wang pouring tea. Zhao Jing comes in and Xie’er immediately takes his cloak from him. Zhao Jing tells Xie’er about the meeting and how everyone’s fawning over him and doing what he wants. Xie-wang apparently pulled “a little trick” to get Sirius Fortress’s chief (天狼寨主), who had a formidable reputation, to join the Alliance. (Another sect, Striking Cloud Hall [惊云堂], joined near the beginning of Zhao Jing expanding the Alliance; Xie-wang compares them to point out how quickly Sirius Fortress folded to his ploy.)
Zhao Jing’s very pleased with how helpful Xie’er’s been, and even praises him. Xie’er still thinks he’s not good enough, since Zhao Jing has been keeping him hidden/in the dark. Zhao Jing says he longs for the day Xie’er can be revealed as his son, but he also says that the Scorpions have a bad reputation and a lot of enemies, so Xie’er needs to patiently stay in the shadows for now.
Xie’er accepts this, and says he’ll do whatever Zhao Jing says. Zhao Jing then tells him to use some Ghost Valley minions and kill Bai Qifeng, chief of the Fairy Ray Sect (仙霞派, which is a way prettier name in chinese; Netflix seems to agree, since its subs say Xianxia Sect), because he knows too much. Xie’er agrees. Then Zhao Jing asks about Long Xiao, who knew some of their secrets but disappeared, and Xie-wang says he hasn’t heard word yet. Xie-wang suspects Long Xiao was kidnapped, and he’s sent people to investigate.
The scene cuts to Long Xiao’s drug men pit. WKX, ZZS, and Chengling stand on the ledge overlooking it. Long Xiao is also up there, but he’s lying on the ground at their feet.
It’s not a great visual! Especially when Long Xiao has been established to need a wheelchair! I know he’s a defeated enemy and that this is a very standard framing for that, but usually defeated enemies in this position are restrained/rendered powerless by an external force (e.g., a rope, injuries caused by the preceding fight) and not by the limitations of their own disabled body.
ZZS questions Long Xiao about who told him to lie at the Heroes Conference, and WKX says he’ll kick Long Xiao off the cliff if he refuses to answer. ZZS says he doesn’t want to force Long Xiao to answer questions, out of respect for Long Que as his father.
Long Xiao refuses to accept Long Que as his father, then rolls himself off the cliff. He lands in the drug men’s pit, right in the center of the plinth, and says that “this body was given by him [presumably Long Que]” and so Long Xiao will return it to him, and he won’t tell them what they want to know.
While everyone looks on, Long Xiao pulls a bell from his robes and rings it, summoning the drug men to him. They swarm and consume him. WKX says Long Xiao deserved to die a hundred times for what he’s done; ZZS says he was still Long Que’s only child.
There’s a quick cut to Longyuan valley, where ZZS, WKX, and Chengling stand in front of two graves. One (Long Que’s) is far newer than the other (his wife Yu Zhui’s). ZZS suggests they go to the library to find a map, and thus the way out. Plus, ZZS reminds Chengling that he’ll need to work hard to master Longyuan Pavillion’s secrets and keep their techniques alive.
ZZS leads them all off, and they pass YBY, who comes to stand in front of the graves. YBY doesn’t say anything, and ZZS says they’ll leave first.
A shot of one of the Scorpion’s men, looking down at the valley and noticing YBY, WKX, and ZZS. He thinks about this, then goes off to inform Xie-wang.
A shot of YBY looking at Long Que’s grave.
ZZS leads Chengling and WKX out of another tunnel. WKX says he wanted to hear what YBY was muttering, but ZZS says they should go and Chengling grabs WKX’s hand and drags him along behind, also taking ZZS’s hand so that he’s leading them both for a moment. When they stop, he asks where they’re going.
WKX laughs a little, and then says first that he wonders where GX is (though he’s sure she’s fine) and then that he wants to watch and see what the fallout for the Five Lakes Alliance was. ZZS coughs, and WKX’s attention (and hands) immediately goes to him. WKX says ZZS will catch a cold for not wearing enough layers, and ZZS waves him off even as WKX teases him for his fragility. WKX then says they should find somewhere warm, after all this is done, and retire there.
ZZS doesn’t acknowledge that and asks Chengling where he wants to go. Chengling says he’ll go wherever ZZS does. ZZS puts an arm over Chengling’s shoulder and says they’ll go to Siji Manor. WKX asks if he’s so eager to take his disciple to his master. ZZS responds that it’s their master, and the smile on WKX’s face fades.
WKX questions the relationship he and ZZS has that makes QHZ their master, and ZZS he’ll teach WKX a lesson on behalf of their master if he keeps being stubborn about this. Chengling asks what they’re talking about, and ZZS tells Chengling to call WKX ‘Shishu’ now. Chengling is delighted by this, and does so. WKX immediately says he shouldn’t be called that, and ZZS’s just fooling Chengling.
ZZS calls WKX ‘shidi’ and asks if WKX will acknowledge him as shixiong. WKX calls this nonsense. ZZS starts talking about how having a good disciple like Chengling and finding WKX (his shidi) again is fate being merciful to him, and that it’ll comfort QHZ in death. WKX doesn’t say anything just yet.
A flashback begins. Zhen Yan and Zhen Ruyu watch as Gu Miaomiao attempts to defend them from veiled foes. She seems out of strength, but still doing her best. QHZ shows up in the nick of time and slaughters the people attacking them.
The next shot is indoors, at a building that isn’t actually Siji Manor (but it’s hard to say what it is). QHZ is tending to Zhen Ruyu’s wounds, and Zhen Ruyu thanks him for the rescue. QHZ says they’re brothers, so of course he had to do that, and he won’t accept anything in return. Zhen Yan runs in and demands that QHZ not hurt his dad. GMM carries him away, and Zhen Ruyu apologises on Zhen Yan’s behalf. He says that Zhen Yan witnessed Zhen Ruyu’s tendons being broken (by ZRY’s own master), and he’s been traumatized by this.
QHZ is upset about this. ZRY says it was his fault, and his thoughtlessness could’ve led to the destruction of Healer Valley, so his shifu was forced to make such a dramatic break with him. QHZ asks why people were marching on Healer Valley (he doesn’t think ZRY wanting to help Rong Xuan is enough of an explanation), and we cut away before ZRY answers.
GMM tells Zhen Yan that QHZ is helping them and Zhen Yan shouldn’t be rude to him. Zhen Yan apologises and says he’s scared. GMM comforts him. Young ZZS then walks in from outside, a basket on his back and a puppy in his arms, and asks why Zhen Yan is crying. From the other side, QHZ walks in and greets GMM. He then gestures ZZS over, and introduces ZZS to GMM and Zhen Yan in a very fond way; ZZS tells QHZ to stop teasing him, but is very serious in a way that makes the reason for the teasing obvious.
QHZ praises ZZS for his work collecting herbs, then tells him to go off and play with Zhen Yan. ZZS says he doesn’t know how to play. QHZ acts like of course he does, and ZZS turns to Zhen Yan and asks for his name. Zhen Yan gives it, and then the characters/meaning of his name. Zhen Yan pets the puppy in ZZS’s arms, and asks its name (Yiguo). From there, we get a series of brief shots of them running around outside and playing together and with the puppy.
At the end, they’ve both got little fake grasshoppers they’ve made perched on their hair, and they return to the building, moving carefully so they don’t disturb their toys. They see QHZ and GMM, and Zhen Yan is shocked because he doesn’t recognise his mom; QHZ’s used his disguise skills on GMM. GMM says who she is, and QHZ asks if they want to learn his disguise skill (both Zhen Yan and ZZS nod).
GMM sends them inside to check on ZRY, and Zhen Yan pokes at the moustache now on ZRY’s face in amusement. Then ZRY tells Zhen Yan to kneel to QHZ, then bow three times. Zhen Yan does, without any questions. ZZS asks if they’re taking Zhen Yan with them. QHZ says they will, and that ZZS and Zhen Yan must love and care for each other; especially, ZZS should take care of his shidi.
ZZS is quite enthusiastic about this idea, and steps up to take Zhen Yan’s hands and promise him all the good food and fun things back at home. Zhen Yan’s enchanted by him.
ZRY coughs, and GMM goes to his side. Then ZRY says they’ve spoiled Zhen Yan, so QHZ should make sure to discipline him well. But he adds “[Zhen Yan] is already miserable; please don’t loathe him.” Zhen Yan asks what all this means, and if his parents are leaving without him.
The flashback ends, and WKX thinks about how two decades have passed since then. (The ending theme starts playing.) ZZS and Chengling are sitting down, but WKX is standing up and facing away from them.
ZZS is still very pleased about having his shidi back; he thinks that it won’t matter so much if he doesn’t live long, now that WKX can take up Chengling’s training when he’s gone. He wants to revive Siji Manor, teach Chengling, and carry on QHZ’s legacy (and have WKX do the same), because then ZZS can rest peacefully.
Chengling hadn’t heard that ZZS wouldn’t live long before, so he asks what ZZS meant by that.
WKX, on the other hand, whirls around and tells ZZS to stop talking about this crap and shifting responsibility to WKX instead of taking it on himself. ZZS stands up and says that “Yan” (衍) split into its parts is “Ke Xing” (客行). He explains how he’d made a mistake thinking WKX was Rong Xuan’s kid, and now he knows WKX is his Zhen-didi. He hugs WKX. WKX does not hug him back; his hands clench into fists.
ZZS asks why WKX changed his surname to Wen. After like ten seconds, WKX shoves ZZS away and says his surname is Wen. ZZS says he won’t ask anymore, but he does want to know what happened. (Chengling would like to know anything about what’s going on.) WKX starts clutching his head as the Meng Po Soup starts fucking with him. ZZS asks if he’s alright.
WKX runs off, and ZZS keeps Chengling from chasing him.
After a bit of running, WKX ends up staring at the river. There, he says “It’s too late” a few times, looks like he’s going to start crying, and the episode comes to an end.
General Commentary
Long Que’s relationship with his chains (and death) has to be an intentional mirror to Zhou Zishu’s relationship with the nails. As I said in the summary, Wen Kexing explicitly compares their situations about metal being stuck through their meridians. Long Que thinks of survival as torture (which the Nails explicitly make life for those who carry them) and doesn’t want to bear them into the afterlife (which isn’t something I think Zhou Zishu ever really talks about explicitly, but it sure seems like he’d start thinking about whether that’s something he’d want after this).
Beyond that, Long Que says “My friends have died, so has my love and my disciples. I owe the world nothing.” which… well, when Wen Kexing pretends to die, Zhou Zishu does still have Chengling (a disciple), as well as Jing Beiyuan and Wu Xi (friends, if ones he’s only recently reconnected with). But compared to the friends and disciples of Siji Manor he’s lost (and Han Ying), as well as Wen Kexing appearing to be gone forever, it’s understandable why Zhou Zishu is too grief-struck to care. (More discussion of that when the episode comes, of course.)
It’s fun, too, that Zhou Zishu hands Baiyi to Wen Kexing to free Long Que. Ye Baiyi helping Wen Kexing is integral to both Wen Kexing’s fake death (and Zhou Zishu’s subsequent nail-yeeting) and Wen Kexing saving Zhou Zishu (at almost the cost of Wen Kexing’s own life) at the end. It doesn’t feel strange in the context of this scene, which means the emotions of this scene were beautifully designed to have it feel in-character. But once I start looking at these parallels, it also feels so intentional and is a brilliant bit of subtle foreshadowing.
I wonder if Zhou Zishu would’ve been able to hold out longer on confronting Wen Kexing about being Zhen Yan if he hadn’t wanted to comfort the dying Long Que. I think so. Zhou Zishu’s been fairly good about asking questions (instead of making statements) and attempting to let Wen Kexing tell him things at his own pace. But it’s also possible that finding his shidi again is a big enough thing that Zhou Zishu might not have been able to let it go? Hard to say.
Long Xiao has agency in his death, at least, and the knowledge that Long Que really does think he did the best he could. Long Que probably could’ve done better (seeing as Long Xiao didn’t know/believe Long Que couldn’t access the Armory until all this went down), but all the mechanisms (accessibility aids, etc) he built for Long Xiao and taught Long Xiao how to build do matter. It’s not like Long Que thought Long Xiao was incapable due to his disability, and Long Xiao isn’t said to be the reason Long Que hid away. So, y’know. That’s something.
We’re hitting some of the stuff between Xie’er and Zhao Jing that fascinates me. The show’s starting to build up the complexities of their relationship and also the ways their ambitions align and (because of that alignment) compete. Xie-wang wanting to be a known political entity of his own, but Zhao Jing saying “Not yet” (in a way that reads as “when I say so, and possibly I’ll string you along forever”), is a clear way of showing how Xie-wang’s testing the boundaries of what he’s allowed when Zhao Jing’s in a good mood and pleased with his work.
The different ways that Gu Xiang and Liu Qianqiao relate to their men (and the differences between their men!) is always interesting to see directly paralleled on-screen. I like, also, that this episode shows that Gu Xiang and Cao Weining—despite often being painted as some of the less intelligent/clever characters in this show—are perfectly able to put pieces together when given the appropriate information. They have access to facts Liu Qianqiao and Yu Qiufeng don’t (though I suspect that Yu Qiufeng should know about the friendship between Mo Huaiyang and Gao Chong), so they can infer where the glazed armor is more accurately.
On my first watch, I didn’t catch how Liu Qianqiao and Gu Xiang’s discussion of how the Meng Po Soup is affecting Luo Fumeng is a set-up for Wen Kexing’s reaction at the end of the episode. (And context for some of his head-clutching last episode!) Once you know the memories that Wen Kexing lost, then it’s a lot easier to see how all of this is set-up for Wen Kexing struggling with memories he hasn’t thought about (or been able to think about!) this much for decades.
...okay, so, the shidi thing.
The group of irl friends I got into this show with included someone who had been following the translation of Tian Ya Ke as it came out, and who was just like “SHIDI! WHAT! THE FUCK!” once they got to this episode. The other friend and I were also like “WHAT” but not mad about it in the same way, since SHL had been our first exposure to this canon. (Though we’d both read the TYK translation by this point.)
Another friend, watching later, almost quit the show over this. And I get why. It’s the thing I was mad about too. Not them being shixiongdi—I think that’s an interesting plot element, and very useful for SHL sneaking around censorship—but that Wen Kexing’s reaction to being called Zhen Yan is the same vehement denial that reads (to me, and that friend, who are both trans people in trans communities) like someone’s reaction to being deadnamed.
So like. The shidi thing fascinates me as a plot twist/reveal. It’s been set up! I’ve been commenting on that as we’ve built to this point, because it’s cool seeing how the viewer is given the same information (and same misunderstandings) as Zhou Zishu. It’s an element that really shows the way SHL breaks from TYK and is its own thing. It plays into a lot of romantic tropes, while also giving a screen of brotherhood for the most daring bits of gayness to hide behind. I like all of those things!
I also find it very uncomfortable to watch those parts of this episode because Wen Kexing has actively left that identity behind and become someone else entirely. Zhou Zishu wants to put him in a shidi box, here, that Wen Kexing does not identify with and doesn’t seem interested in returning to. And Zhou Zishu keeps pushing it! Which I get; he’s very happy, and this takes a weight off his shoulders. But I feel for Wen Kexing and his freak-outs and active and loud negation of that name/identity.
(Later, when he uses his identity as Zhou Zishu’s shidi first to rescue Zhou Zishu and then to make a dramatic entrance at the second heroes conference, he’s doing so by his own choice and under his own control; it’s different. Plus, by those points he’s had a lot longer to think about how being Zhou Zishu’s shidi again doesn’t mean needing to be Zhen Yan, and find a balance of identity that works for him.)
Discussion Prompts/Questions
1. So, what do you think of the whole shidi reveal? Did it surprise you on your first watch? Have your feelings about it changed over time?
2. We’ve now seen everything about Long Que and Long Xiao! Do you have thoughts or feelings about their relationship or portrayal on this show?
3. I didn’t focus very much on Liu Qianqiao and Gu Xiang in my commentary, but I’d love to hear your thoughts about them and their relationships! What do you think of how Yu Qiufeng is portrayed? Does Liu Qianqiao being gay for Luo Fumeng come across? How about Gu Xiang’s slowly softening heart in the face of Cao Weining’s good-natured earnestness?
Next Time: Xie-wang and the ghosts scheme together. We learn about how Wen Kexing became Valley Master. More politics with Zhao Jing! Wen Kexing meets with the girls from the Department of the Unfaithful. Xie-wang finds and captures Liu Qianqiao and the people with her. Also, of course, Zhou Zishu and Wen Kexing talk.
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Yeah ZZS’ so overjoyed to have another alive disciple of Siji Manor that’s he’s completely failing to read WKX’s reaction. iirc ZZS internalizes the name stuff fairly quickly once he gets over his excitement (see the stuff in episode 22 with Shen Shen), but can’t seem to let go of the shidi part.
1) I don’t actually remember if I was surprised or not (I really need to remember to takes notes when I watch stuff). I love how adorable young ZZS and WKX are together!
<-- this sequence kinda gives me betrothal vibes for some reason
2) I have mixed feeling about Long Que and Long Xiao’s story. I wish the narrative gave Long Xiao more sympathy or made Long Que more ambiguous w/r/t their choices and motivations (like there’s a definite contrast between how the story treats Long Xiao and Xie’er).
3) I LOVE Gu Xiang and Cao Weining’s relationship! They’re so cute together! I also adore Liu Qianqiao and Luo Fumeng’s relationship! (I definitely want to make a femslash vid of them at some point) I love that we get to see LQQ taking care of LFM. I like how the show lets LQQ call Yu Qiufeng naïve when he tells her his ideas (and imho he’s really digging himself into a deeper hole re: LQQ’s opinion of him with how he talks about LFM). Tbh once he mentions the Yin Yang book it seems like LQQ might be thinking about how to get it for LFM.
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iirc ZZS internalizes the name stuff fairly quickly once he gets over his excitement (see the stuff in episode 22 with Shen Shen), but can’t seem to let go of the shidi part.
Yeah, that's my recollection as well.
I don’t actually remember if I was surprised or not (I really need to remember to takes notes when I watch stuff)
Eh, you don't need to take notes! That makes it more academic than I think watching things should be, the first time around. :) (I mean, if that's fun for you, then go for it! But it isn't how most people think about entertainment media...)
this sequence kinda gives me betrothal vibes for some reason
It sure did to me, too! :D
(like there’s a definite contrast between how the story treats Long Xiao and Xie’er)
There's a lot of contrasts. Xie'er gets to be a POV character, and the narrative is designed to show him as a character with ambiguous/dark gray morality (but some good points). Long Xiao isn't a POV character, and he's not given much narrative space even in the episodes he exists within.
But yeah even without that Long Xiao isn't given narrative sympathy. He's not framed in ways that make it easy to understand his pain or what he thinks, so you've gotta have your own pre-existing knowledge and probably watch the scenes multiple times before any of his humanity really comes through clearly.
Tbh once he mentions the Yin Yang book it seems like LQQ might be thinking about how to get it for LFM.
Yeah, probably. Which is fun, since YQF is thinking about giving it to LQQ for her own healing. (Or, really, to assuage his guilt, but...)
(also I'm very :eyes: about the idea of you making a LQQ/LFM femslash vid! :D please share it with everyone, whenever you do make it! <3)
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iirc, unlike the other extended episodes, YouTube doesn’t actually mention it that it’s extended (or have the shorter version).
Eh, you don't need to take notes! That makes it more academic than I think watching things should be, the first time around. :) (I mean, if that's fun for you, then go for it! But it isn't how most people think about entertainment media...)
It’s mostly that now I’m really curious what I thought at the time, tbh.
It sure did to me, too! :D
I’m glad it’s not just me! :)
(also I'm very :eyes: about the idea of you making a LQQ/LFM femslash vid! :D please share it with everyone, whenever you do make it! <3)
I definitely will!
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1. I am a big fan of childhood friends to lovers as a trope, so the shidi reveal delights me, especially since I thought the script made it into an interesting conflict between them over the next several episodes, and how they came to a middle ground about it. It's a process that takes work. Like you said, WKX eventually comes to the conclusion that it doesn't have to mean being Zhen Yan. I think ZZS realizes this as well, like in an upcoming episode (23 maybe?), when he defends WKX's choices about his own name and past to Shen Shen. He also makes a point to say Wen Kexing's full name when he's trying to talk him through another breakdown, rather than nicknames, shidi, or anything else. It's all about two deeply traumatized people trying to navigate each other's traumas with no roadmap. They're gonna make a lot of mistakes, especially with such a HUGE gap of being apart from each other, but they keep trying and learning and growing together from those mistakes. It's what I love about their relationship the most, I think.
2. I...think I did have a follow up in mind on this, but I can't remember what it was now. /facepalm
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I don't think it's been discussed! It's often in the back of my mind, but it's just so hard to tell what's intentional obfuscation and what's WKX having memory issues. In part, I've been waiting to ask what things people think WKX remembers when until we get to the episodes where WKX talks about his parents' death and trying to resist the Meng Po Soup, because I just don't remember how that's framed! But I'm happy to hear any thoughts you have.
Though in some ways, for this, I wonder if Zhen Yan was even told that this fancy hairpin he'd been given was the armory key! You can't forget what you never knew to begin with. It might be that he only puts that together after hearing that there is a key.
It's all about two deeply traumatized people trying to navigate each other's traumas with no roadmap. They're gonna make a lot of mistakes, especially with such a HUGE gap of being apart from each other, but they keep trying and learning and growing together from those mistakes. It's what I love about their relationship the most, I think.
Yes! All of this! :D I love it so much! <3
2. I...think I did have a follow up in mind on this, but I can't remember what it was now. /facepalm
No worries! :) If you remember later, I'd love to know what it was, but I'm not fussed one way or the other.
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Now I'm kinda curious about that! (I think he might, since iirc the Meng Po Soup is mostly effecting his memories re: ZJ's role in his parent's death) Also, I didn't realize until now that him having the key makes the rumors about the Ghost Valley having a piece of the armor actually true (even if it isn't the kind of piece people are thinking of)
It really does!
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